Malheur Refuge & Sugar Pine Comparison

Update (3/3/16)

Some feel that what we need, is to not put so much energy or discussion in bringing up past incidents, or feelings of betrayal. Their concerns are Not, “To lose our Focus about who the real ‘enemies’ are that appear to have declared War on us.”

‘At the end of the day,’ You and You alone are accountable as to whether you want to participate in whole or in part in whatever cause(s) you are supporting. If you sense or suspect that you are somehow partially misled or not given the entire truth; it is up to you to continue or withdraw, and put your energies elsewhere. You need to develop or call upon your intuition.

When you donate of your funds, or physically contribute to a cause you believe in:  be cautious, be vigilant and aware. You DO have a right to worry about “plants” or actors that are not concerned about the truth, but in helping others to make a quota.

Second Trial in Portland.

We agreed in part and/or in whole on the mixed feelings of the group in Portland yesterday.

One of the individuals in Portland at “Patriots Corner,” stated something along the lines that, ‘ Yes there may be some in the so called Patriot community that have used the situation for their own benefit. But if we keep calling them out and bringing up the past….we misuse our energy that should be focused on the most serious Issues in front of us now and into the future.’

A female supporter at Portland ( March 2, 2017); added that we just need to be more cautionary  about who we trust, or in ‘ Vetting.  We know that it will not always be sure proof of who really understands, and/or supports our concerns.  We were told, ‘ Do not be afraid of those that are ‘plants’ or “Moles.” ‘It is not this person or that, that are now known as deceivers, or possible informants, who were self serving….that is the main problem.’ It is the government (s) that “have become so corrupt and self serving, feeding on its own.” And the government agencies that get these people to do their illegal, unconstitutional  or criminal  actions.

We would be remiss to not state very important facts/ truths that need to be noted.

Some of us worked and ate beside many  at the “Sugar Pine Stand” in 2015.  This peaceful ‘Stand,’ was due to Federal Overreach of Department of Forestry/BLM.  Federal agencies were  bullying and  committing  many violations and abuses, against  Land ownership/usage; as well as ignoring the Constitution. They were ignoring and/or laughing in the face of  Due Process.” We were made aware that the Department of Forestry and Bureau of land Management had for decades burned down summer cabins and summer homes, during winter months.  In the spring when the roads were passable and people visited their cabins, homes or their mining rights, they were accused of having ‘abandoned,’ their sites. They were informed that the land now “belonged”  to the government agencies.

Few people had the funds or savings to ‘fight city hall,’ meaning the State and Federal agencies.  The agencies that use our tax dollars to wear us down, knowing that most will be forced ultimately to give up.  Some died trying. Some families picked up the ball, and paid a huge price… losing in the end to the rules and regulations that appeared sometimes out of thin air. Some created and/or enacted to get the agencies final agenda accomplished. This theft and abuse occurs all around the county, with some  put into prison to silence them, or paid the ultimate price trying to expose the truth.

Many of the observations and facts listed in the full transcript sent to us on the “Seven Incitements….” reference some individuals; we found ourselves with at  Sugar Pine.  Some insinuated or declared they were the only “leadership” volunteers, and “negotiators” capable of being fully  there for the Miners. Secret meetings with  comments made that “intel” had to be kept to the “inner circle.” Yet the individuals or situations we were warned about, never were identified nor occurred. No proof was given that anything nefarious was amiss, or had been a real concern.  This reminded me of the Kings and surfs. Also of warlords like the former ‘Librarian,’  by the name “General Bethlehem,” in the movie with Kevin Costner “The Postman.”

Some were trusted with personal Individual information (safekeeping)  for emergency or “vetting” purposes. A discovery was made that the trust had been violated. Private personal information was shared with unapproved ( by the volunteers) sources, and in some cases put out on social media to silence others from speaking to the group or groups of other volunteers, of concerns.

 Some volunteers felt deceived, and felt their volunteer status was as “subordinates,” discounted as to their contributions as volunteers for a common cause. What was suppose to be a peaceful team effort, was being falsely reported or touted in the media as terrorism. Sometimes because of the spouting’s of some who were ‘coordinating’ volunteer efforts, or providing ” security.” Some were more concerned about media seeking or ego rather then providing regular teamwork with the group.  Things were discovered later that were withheld from volunteers, with false representation. Often they were told  that what was wanted was a peaceful conclusion, but it was about making a name for oneself for other future agenda’s.

Our friend up in Portland, said “look at all the Good,” so and so did….. that Perhaps (?)  we need to overlook the things that may have been going on behind the curtain. Lets just worry about the future! And many would argue….that is exactly what we are doing in questioning occurrences or results. ‘We as a people’ are concerned about the possible future (desired) peaceful civil protest; in reference to continued usurpations or abuses by individuals and/or groups or agencies.

A wrongful seizure or exercise of authority or privilege belonging to another; an encroachment: “in our own day, gross usurpations upon the liberty of private life” (John Stuart Mill).

This is what happened to Mr. Hill’s property and cattle in Montana. This is what happened to the Bundy cattle when the BLM and others rounded up Bundy cattle and confined them and/or tried to sell them illegally out of state. And when the Feds, went out flying and shooting and killing cows and their babies from above, and burying them. ( See the True Bundy Story). Warning: Some pictures are graphic.


What was interesting is that it was reported to us that the very individual who was then “Coordinator” of  an   organization,  standing up to the BLM, ( and later facing down the FBI at Malheur); was reported to be married to an employee/contractor (?) of the Department of Forest Service. The DFS that works closely in conjunction with the BLM.  We do not believe this should be suppressed.

And it was reported and evidence presented, that the gas receipts from said spouse to go to and from their daily job, were turned in to the  treasurer(s) to be reimbursed –from donated funds  that were meant for food and living necessities  for volunteers in support of the “Stand for Due Process.”  Many individuals were and are being called out, and often evidence presented  that some of  those we trusted, proved themselves Untrustworthy, in some regards. “Monies May have been misappropriated, but that is not the main battle,” stated a spokesperson. “We can not lose our focus or misuse our energies towards the most important concerns.”

Many of the same occurrences that happened when instigators inserted themselves into the Refuge story, was behavior we experienced at Sugar Pine in 2015.  Our questions, serious concerns and facts falling on deaf ears while people blindly followed and worshiped. One of the defendants in the Malheur story feels that it is his opinion, that people should have gone up and called out the FBI and others. That they should have been approached,  informed/educated and then if necessary, chewed out. He never conspired then or now to bring physical or mental harm to the government employees.

(Note- 3/10/2017)  Jason Patrick and Darryl Thorn are wrongly convicted of “Conspiracy,” based on the limited evidence the defendants were allowed to present to the jurors, with Anna Brown manipulating the court proceedings. Jason was determined to be the leader by others, when R. Levoy Finicum was assassinated by state and Federal Mercenaries. He was always “Public Relations,” at Sugar Pine and in Harney county. He kept people calm and collected. This is a travesty of Justice, while the real criminals… as always walk away.

Defendants in the “Bundy” situation of 2014 and at the Refuge, or “Harney County Resource Center” experience; know that at no time did they advocate violence, or destruction of property. (This can also be said for the feelings of volunteers and/or protesters as well as the Landowners/miners, at “Sugar Pine Stand”).  The Bundy’s and other ranchers wanted to be safe. “They were in actual fear of the BLM and other agencies, and wanted protection, and witness’s to come from the people,” stated David Y. ” They wanted the truth to come out.  Not sensationalism as to the true agenda and messages that were trying to have conveyed. They did not want their stories and concerns to be distorted or turned into a three ring circus in ether local.” Nancy V.

They never, Never actually imagined that someone, Anyone (especially Levoy, would be ambushed and murdered/assassinated  in cold blood on the way- to a scheduled meeting with ranchers and farmers and others.

This meeting was to peacefully discuss Land Rights, BLM overreach and abuses. Crimes that people in uniform are so often, absolved from because they are local, or State and Federal employees.

Ranchers and farmers and others were, (by emails and texts) referred as a “Virus,” by the Oregon Governor and her staff, and the Obama administration,  It was stated that this “Virus,” had to be stopped at all cost, “before it spreads,” and “whatever it takes.”

Individuals had gone back and forth for weeks from the “Harney County Resource Center,” ( Wildlife Refuge), to the towns of Hines/Burns. And they travelled elsewhere not impeded once, from free travel. Local, state and federal groups, appeared to be keeping the lines of communication and negotiation open. Then without warning, or warrants; conspire to do an unjustified road stop, ambush/assault, and shoot someone with their hands in the air?

A Rancher, and Constitutional advocate, who was on his way with a vocal group, to a publicized meeting,  to talk about the Constitution of the uSA?  The group  wanted to talk about “Committees of Safety,” or the peoples Right to gather a “Peoples Grand jury” to address and investigate crimes or gievances of abuses? Can’t have a family sing Spiritual or patriotic songs either?

What is this form of Dictatorship we appear to be living under? Why are we feeling the boots of a growing police state? “Do people not see that this is the way that some UN Officials handle things in their own countries?” Stephen W.

In Reference to roped off or Fenced in “Free Speech areas:”

“It is totally wrong and a form of ‘imprisonment,’ to force people into an (out of the way) fenced in area to speak their mind to the air around them. This defeats the purpose of educating and redressing our governments for actual grievances, theft and abuses towards its countrymen.” Susan L.

Why can’t people take a stand, on their own ‘county and public lands,’ that is ” belonging,” in actuality to “WE THE PEOPLE?” Our lands supported by our tax dollars. “…Peaceful civil protest on the very Grounds that represent illegal Land grabs by the federal government back in the 1920’s -40’s and beyond.” Mike B.

Educating and encouraging people to talk, learn and Stand together should not be a sin. Nor should free speech or peaceful protest, be labelled “Terrorism,” to illicit a false narrative response.  The Hammonds are not, were not and never would be “terrorist.” Standing up for their property rights and grazing rights that they paid for, is not a terrorist activity. Nor defending their property from BLM screw-ups.

Ranchers and farmers forced into financial ruin, loss of their homes and livelihoods, have lived in fear and with intimidation for decades. People have been dragged into ‘their’ courts and forced into bankruptcy for trying to defend against the theft of their lands. People beat up and/or murdered for standing up against corrupt county, state and/or federal employees, and those who are secretly ‘on the take.’

People told to shut up “or else.”

This “Virus” (OREGON Kate Brown/Governor, and the 2016 WHITE HOUSE) stated that it could NOT be allowed to “spread.” How is it that individuals or families  or groups that are violated and/or abused can not speak out? Cannot educate others as to the dissolving of our rights and birthright freedoms; without being called a cancer or virus to be isolated, locked away or destroyed, by ‘any or all means?’

Perhaps we need and should Get in the faces, (without threats or insults thrown), of the state and federal employees and chastise them for being Sheeple.  Remind them that their “oath of Office” are not just words. That many of them are violating the ‘Trust’ of WE THE PEOPLE.  Many are of the ‘conviction,’ that  many employees are selling their souls for that paycheck and financial security, or that next reward or promotion. These local, state or federal employees are  the ones “Conspiring” to bring harm or loss of property and/or Life to their fellow man. And many judges at local and higher levels of government are also knowingly co conspirators to keep their jobs.

According to Wikipedia, and the “Urban Dictionary:”

Sheeple. People unable to think for themselves. Followers. Lemmings. Those with no cognitive abilities of their own.” 

“A individual that forfeits their right to choose in favor of inclusion in groupthink and what is viewed as popular or elite group. Allowing the influences of different forms of media and group members to hold great sway in the formation of attitudes, behavior and opinion.
To accept the group mentality and opinion as fact without examination.
Not only to be told what to do, but accepting the paradigm of thought as absolute thereby removing the weight of personal responsibility in the making of decisions.”



(a portmanteau of “sheep” and “people”) is a derogatory term that highlights the passive herd behavior of people easily controlled by a governing power which likens them to sheep, a herd animal that is easily led about.”


Remind employees, local, state and federal that ‘We the People’…their ‘Employers’- hold all of them accountable, in and out of uniform on and off duty.

Remind them of the Nuremburg Trials, following WWII.  And, of “The Mỹ Lai Massacre,” during the Vietnam police action.

Ones going forth and calling the Feds out, reminding them of the Constitution and illegalities of which they are participating in, is one thing.  Calling them names or throwing insults, serves no one.  It may make you feel good at the moment,  or release  “justified anger and feelings of Betrayal.”  All it does is cause some to lose creditability . Or it dilutes the message or messages  we are trying to educate the People ( including the state or federal agencies) of what is at stake-Now and into the Future.

NOTE: Remember that groups calling themselves “Watch” groups such as SPLC, may be in bed with certain  state and federal agencies and get private and public monies to become wealthier and more powerful. They label and slander American’s  and demonize them, because of their conservative views.  They are  agitators or “hate groups.”

We, as a People need to hold accountable:  much of the Liberal ( and often controlled) Media.  THEY use ‘Buzz’ words to illicit a desired emotional or psychological response.  Some individuals did this  at Sugar Pine, and later when they went ‘Unasked ‘to force themselves into the Malheur equation. Later using social media to have money donations sent to their groups. Many families of those slain or who had harm brought to bear towards them and/or their families have noted or stated “Whom Can we Trust any longer? “

The people and families that I met at the Malheur Refuge are Not….I repeat…Not “Anti Government.”  Many want less federal and state intrusions and abuses into their day to day lives.  They want actual transparency, and more important, legitimate accountability at all levels. And this also is in regards to those that inserted themselves into civil protests but always walk away, untouched after others are killed and/or made into political prisoners due to the “actors” or instigators (often unasked for) involvements.   

As was noted from part of the transcript sent to us (“The Seven Incitements..”), in reference to Malheur (Harney County, Oregon); we at the Sugar Pine Operation also had Psyops type games played on us; resulting in my having to send two individuals off the mountain and to Emergency in town. I am a licensed nurse.

Definition of : ” Psychological operations (PSYOP) are planned operations to convey selected information and indicators to audiences to influence their emotions, motives, and objective reasoning, and ultimately the behavior of governments, organizations, groups, and individuals.” (Wikipedia)

“They made public claims that the Refuge occupiers were about to be killed by elite hit squads of federal agents and military forces. Their supposed reliable source was never revealed.” (Incite/ Malheur)  and

“Expecting an imminent attack the Refuge occupiers were more liable to have their nerves on hair trigger and shoot at what could be mistaken for a lethal federal attack.” (Incite/Malheur)

This was exactly what we experienced at Sugar Pine up on the mountain, with the same three or four individuals. It was eerily similar to the Malheur facts and incidents posted in the below Transcript. Even to the point that one of the individuals with pilot training borrowed a helicopter from a friend and business partner in Medford to touch land near our location. This occurred right above the miners gold mine. They then went up on FB and websites to report the Feds and/or BLM ( and others), had been about to descend on us.

We on the mountain near the gold mine shaft were told we were on “High Alert.” Some went days without sleep. Many were drinking energy drinks, and for some – severe dehydration followed necessitating a trip to the ER.

Eric Parker, and Ryan Payne have prior to Harney county and after, noted  the same patterns that WE The PEOPLE ourselves noted. 

Patriots,”  ” Constitutionalist,” and ” Militia,”  should be no more a dirty word…then they were prior to the 20th century. It is unfortunate that we have those that insert themselves into our mist for their own agenda’s, or to seek favor  or possible profit from others. We are hoping that community service patriot groups, and others will be able to remove themselves from those that would give others a bad or false public image. That they can then present to the communities they live in that they are there for the People, not for fame or glory or ‘other’ agendas that do not serve the public good.

It was a common conception at the time that there were some conflicting messages put out in social media; due to some postings and interviews given by those not at the Harney County Resource Center/Refuge.  They reported this was not an operation or ‘protest,’ that they could support. Of course, it was not their idea. This was not the brain child of certain self proclaimed “patriot” and freedom loving liberty groups.

Nor did the Hammonds, Bundy’s or Levoy Finicum request their presence. They never intended for it to morph into what it did.  Regardless, a former coordinator of a patriot group (now dissolved); and a  (now) Former 3% President  went there and encouraged others to follow suit.  They started using social media to issue “orders” and demands of arriving volunteers, and “instructions” for individuals or groups to “report” to them.  As things transpired, a national spokesperson was forced to send a board member of the National organization to try to assure that calm and common sense would prevail. Unfortunate that some others, took it upon themselves to assign themselves the duty of “negotiators, ” all the while appearing to fan the flames increasing stress and fear on both sides.

I want to caution you as you read this and/or watch  social media video Links; to note that some social media out there are for increasing ratings and sensationalism. Many have their own opinions and answers to what should be done in a particular situation. Some think their way to resolve something, is the only answer or way.  One must remind oneself that there is not a “one size fits all ” answer. Cool heads must prevail. Incorrect perceptions can undermine well intentioned goals.

As it is felt by a few, that what we need to do is not bring up past incidents to cause us “To lose our Focus about who the real ‘enemies’ are that have declared War on us.”  One individual went on to say, “That Yes there may be some in the so called Patriot community that have used the situation for their own benefit, but if we keep calling them out and bringing up the past….we misuse our energy that should be focused on the most serious Issues in front of us.”  He and a female supporter at Portland yesterday ( March 2, 2017); felt that we just need to be more cautionary about who we trust, or in Vetting. The corporations and agencies, that want to control the people and manipulate our lives are good at disguise, manipulations,  and social engineering.  Do not be afraid of those that are ‘plants’ or “Moles.”

It appears that many of the same concerns that were witnessed at Sugar Pine, is now coming to light in a 3% group- involving some of the same key individuals. This is forcing dozens in a western state, to publish as statement of concern and vote of no confidence and even leave the group requesting an investigation. (Per the “Idaho Statesman”)

Again, there are those cautioned by some of the patriots to not let this divide, or cause  people to be “Distracted” as to what the Real concerns need to be focused on. Some would disagree and feel that if we can’t trust those in our mist, then all is already lost. That we need a better vetting or checks and balances. That those we perceive as our former co volunteers or “Friends,” need to just be ignored for their actions and not held fully accountable or questioned as to their real agenda’s. It is a known fact that the powers to be, will use people against each other. They will use all means of manipulations, intimidations and/or threats to get people to bend to their will.

We must caution ourselves not to judge or accuse ALL US Marshalls, law enforcement officers or government employees, nor Patriot groups, for the actions of a few.  We caution the reader Not to lump all individuals into the same mix, due to a few individuals who may have been  trying to gain profit, privilege  or notoriety.

If you see or are made aware of anything that appears to be improper on either side of the isle, it behooves you to report it to another to be investigated. Even if you are a government employee. Please be courageous and do not ‘play along, to get along.’ Why did the supervisor of the BLM, during the 2014 Bundy stand, not have employees question or take corrective action? Was it because they were afraid of retaliation for questioning unlawful operations or misconduct?

Please keep in the upper most of your mind what the  Truth to messages are/ were, what the Issues were and who the real peacemakers were. Always be weary of dis tractors or possible government ‘actors’ or infiltrators, to your good and honorable intentions or peaceful protest. Keep Prayer for guidance and/or Faith always at the Ready.

What my family and I observed for three days while staying in a hotel in Burns and traveling the county, was Levoy and Ryan Payne, and the Bundy’s educating people as to their rights and duties under the Constitution. We ourselves participated in a two hour class, with question/ answer periods throughout.

The Bundy’s were not part of any “Militia,” and if they had been- they Still would have been trying to educate and train people for community emergency preparedness, or any adverse circumstances or conditions Natural or manmade. This is what we have observed many are trying to do.   MrM

      “The Seven Incitements of Malheur”   (partial of Transcript)

” Ms. Rose, have you seen this? It sheds light on what really happened to Lavoy Finicum and the Bundy family.” S2T

On Friday, December 9, 2016 8:43 AM,

The Seven Incitements of Malheur (partial transcript):

The recent “Not Guilty” verdict on the Malheur Refuge occupation validates that it was peaceful civil disobedience.  Occupying federal property in protest has a long civil rights history in America.  The jury concluded rightly that Ammon Bundy and company were not the violent potential murderers that law enforcement apparently believed them to be.  Law enforcement acted like they believed it was more of a military engagement than a civil rights protest…….”

The Bundys knew what trouble….. (some “volunteers” could bring)… by their experience with them at Bunkerville. They wanted no part of these agitators and told them to leave……What would have been a peaceful protest of civil disobedience was fanned into a violent crisis by these unwanted media hounds and crisis profiteers.  Ryan Payne had it right when he called it “provocateurism”, though he may not have known back then just how deadly and dangerous these provocateurs would ultimately be.” 

“The jury found Shawna Cox, the Bundys, and the other occupiers not guilty. Clearly the accused took no actions that threatened or harmed law enforcement.  Their civil disobedience was just the latest in a long history of civil rights protests in America.” 

”  Both the Federal law enforcement and the occupying protestors were played in a dangerous game. “

Perhaps the FBI arrested and put the wrong people on trial.”